Official Nvidia position on hybrid ATI+NV PhysX configurations
Back again on banned ATI+Nvidia PhysX configurations situation. Initially, all the hype was based on e-mail from customer care support, while Nvidia official motives were undisclosed. In order to bring some clarity, we’ve asked Nvidia for commentaries a while ago and finally recieved some answers:
PhysXInfo: Is it true that PhysX capabilities of NVIDIA GPUs and/or Ageia PPUs are disabled with newest drivers when a Non-NVIDIA (AMD) graphics card is present in the system?
Nvidia: It is true that running an NVIDIA GPU for PhysX with an AMD GPU for graphics is not a supported configuration. This mode was inadvertently turned on in a beta version of our Win7 drivers and on some older XP drivers. AMD does not support PhysX for their customers, and we don’t QA this configuration. With no QA, it is risky to run this configuration so we removed this capability in a recent driver release.
PhysXInfo: Can you please explain to us what factors have led to such decision?
Nvidia: Today NVIDIA’s GPU and PhysX drivers are interconnected to optimize performance. In the future we expect this interdependence to deepen. This alone makes it difficult to support a third party GPU.
In order to make sure our customers have a great experience, we QA every release of our PhysX or Graphics drivers by testing approximately 14 NVIDIA GPUs for graphics processing with 8 GPUs for PhysX processing on 6 common platforms with 6 OS’s using 6 combinations of CPU and memory. This is over 24000 possible configurations. While we don’t test every possible combination, it should be clear that the work and cost to NVIDIA is substantial. AMD does not support PhysX for their customers. Adding AMD GPUs would significantly increase the necessary work and cost for NVIDIA. We prefer to invest in inventing new technologies that give our customers great new experiences.
PhysXInfo: But to achieve hardware PhysX acceleration, ATI users still need to buy appropriate NVIDIA GPU, and there is no hack or tick here. So what are the benefits for NVIDIA and for NVIDIA consumers in this situation?
Nvidia: For the reasons explained above we only support configurations that we know work. This ensures that our customers will have a great experience. But the real issue is that AMD needs to get serious about their own specific investments in GPU accelerated physics and in GPU computing technologies in general. It is time for them to stop complaining about the things we offer that they do not.
PhysXInfo: Do you have any plans to change your mind in the near future, or even release a dedicated GPU-based pure PhysX card?
Nvidia: Not at this time, given the reasons we mentioned above.
PhysXInfo: What are your plans to support the Ageia PPU?
Nvidia: The AGEIA PPU is supported for Windows XP and Vista. We will continue to support the AGEIA PPUs in these OS’s, but not in Windows 7. For example, we are looking at a bug now for PPU support on XP and expect to have an updated driver for that shortly.
Support for hybrid configurations was restored by enthusiast’s mod recently, but it seems it won’t live long, according to Nvidia position.
Shame!!!
D3lta
9 Oct 09 at 2:45 pm
This is total BS. Sure, they don’t have to support it, but they also don’t have to go out of their way to disable it either. Anyway, I’m done with nvidia…at least as a render card. Just bought a 5850 and plan to use my 9600gt as a physx gpu with modded drivers of course. Thanks GenL! After finishing Batman will probably take out the 9600gt and smash it with a hammer.
ByeBye Nvidia
9 Oct 09 at 6:07 pm
Well thank you so much Nvidia. I hope more companies pick up on your brilliant strategy for the sake of us customers. AMD and Intel could for example disable support for Nvidia graphics cards for their processors. After all, the CPU and GPU is interdependent and it’s hard and expensive for them to test their processors with all possible configurations involving Nvidia cards. I’m sure they want to be able to ensure a great experience for their own customers, and the only way I can see that happening is to disable Nvidia hardware. It’s good to know that Nvidia will support such a decision completely.
Seven
9 Oct 09 at 6:31 pm
ByeBye Nvidia: Don’t smash the card with a hammer. Just sell the card. I sold a 9800GTX+ I had intended to use for PhysX with a 5870 over this. Hopefully cannibalizing a 250 sale for Nv in the process. If we all sell our old Nv cards, that we planned to use for PhysX, it is bound to hurt sales of the high margin renamed parts, like the 250, at least a tiny bit.
gorankar
9 Oct 09 at 9:28 pm
Other official position from Nvidia support:
“PhysX is an open software standard any company can freely develop hardware or software that supports it. Nvidia supports GPU accelerated Physx on NVIDIA GPUs while using NVIDIA GPUs for graphics. NVIDIA performs extensive Engineering, Development, and QA work that makes Physx a great experience for customers. For a variety of reasons – some development expense some quality assurance and some business reasons NVIDIA will not support GPU accelerated Physx with NVIDIA GPUs while GPU rendering is happening on non- NVIDIA GPUs or even if a an ATI card is in the PC. I’m sorry for any inconvenience caused but I hope you can understand. This is not something we control or can change via this support forum.”
Alexandr82
10 Oct 09 at 12:42 am
Well put he before me larrabee is gona bring down the curtains on physx anyway due to its mega support of dx11 compute where will physx be in ten years Gone like a bad only worked on 5 games smell know this Nvidia the PC is here today n great due to people working together on standards for things ,so that They Work your self seperation will lead to 1 thing Nowt MIne Mine MIne they sound like school kids
Mr K
10 Oct 09 at 3:34 pm
Bye Bye Nvidia.No need to buy new NVIDIA card. I am going to use old 9800GTX+ and buy new ATI 5870. Thank you GenL for the patch.
tom
11 Oct 09 at 7:14 pm
Sad that Nvidia and ATI and eventually Intel couldn’t work together on this. Cudos for Nvidia spending the time, energy and resources to bring GPU physics on the forefront. Intel killed Havoc GPU physics after they bought them out, go figure. Since Nvidia has not only further developed Ageia physics but also penetrated the gaming market and developers. It actually makes sense for ATI to help this process along and support PhysX, that is if Nvidia is truely open about the standard and not restrict other hardware configurations once they are developed for. Trust. I can’t believe Nvidia would try to hinder ATI/AMD because that would be like cutting one’s own throat since Nvidia needs ATI/AMD for a platform to stick there GPU’s on. At least yet they do.
noko
12 Oct 09 at 6:44 pm
So rather than allow(!) me to buy a PhysX card for my next computer, they’ll ensure that (as a happy ATI customer) I never buy an NVidia card for _anything_.
I have a dedicated PhysX 100 card in my XP machine, but it looks like I can’t have one in my new Win7 box next week.
Thank you for playing.
wpns
20 Oct 09 at 6:41 pm
Sometimes i wish i was a lawyer in the U.S.A……..
But for now … because of your policy i’ll never buy
a card from you again , even if it’s better than competition.
And of course i’ll tell the story to all my friends……
Sincerely,
F.ck OFF
anastae
30 Oct 09 at 3:57 pm
PS.
I used to be on your side, because Intel is still selling “enhanced multicore Pentium 3’s” as “modern” CPU’s – that’s what an Intel Quad Core is. Therefore stalling technology for the benefit of their pockets.
But you’re even worse. SLI was your idea eh ?????
Believe me i’ve been a software engineer for the last 25 years and i know VERY well who’s idea SLI was. And so on…. As Seven mentioned above AMD and Nvidia should H/W DISABLE support for your cards.
This is my Official Position.
Sincerely, F.ck Off Again
anastae
30 Oct 09 at 4:09 pm
its a complete stack of BS!
i own R 5770 and Ageia dedicated card.
in borderlands graphis is co dramaticly crippled, that i cant belive its UT3 engine!
and last drivers that workes with Ageia cards are 8.10.06
newer drivers simply igoners card, and everything is rendered on ATI GPU!
i hope nvidia die, and all their ‘brainiacs’ responsible for this mess will rot in hell.
its
5 Nov 09 at 2:25 pm
ah, yes.
I have windows 7, and AGEIA PPU works flawlessly!
for egzample crazy machines 2 or Sacred 2
i personally finished playing with nvidia at GF2 , when gigabytes ‘golden samples’ were on top…
and what a supprise… my brother`s much cheaper readeon 9600 destroyed this GF.
and from this time nvidia sucks big time.
its
5 Nov 09 at 2:32 pm
Idiots. I was actually planning on buying a geforce to using alongside my crossfired radeons for PhysX. That’s at least one less sale nVidia will see.
nVidia, does it really make sense to arbitrarily remove 30% of the potential market for PhysX GPUs?
Xjph
27 Dec 09 at 8:48 pm
Are you people not understanding what’s going on here?
NVIDIA stated that they were willing to work with ATI with PhysX but ATI doesn’t want to work with them and they don’t want to support it. NVIDIA doesn’t want to spend more time on getting something that’s not supported, working so they declined supporting the ATI + Hybrid PhysX.
It makes sense and it doesn’t hold them accountable for user’s problems. It’s safer and easier for them to remove functionality otherwise they’d be bombarded with user’s questions.
Had ATI said they wanted to work with NVIDIA to support Hybrid PhysX, you people would be happy because there wouldn’t be these conflicts.
RB
20 Apr 10 at 4:01 am